Rheinmetall CEO Papperger: "Robots are coming"

Germany wants to significantly strengthen its defence capabilities. But this is no longer just about more ammunition and missiles. Air defence, drones and new technologies such as humanoid robots and space-based systems are also playing an increasingly important role. ADVERTISEMENT ADVERTISEMENT Rheinmetall CEO Armin Papperger talks about rearmament, current bottlenecks, and which weapons systems could be decisive in the future. At the keel-laying ceremony for the third fleet service boat of class 424 in Wolgast, we spoke to Papperger about Germany's arms production, the role of the Skyranger and the weapons of the future. Euronews: Mr Papperger, in March you said missile stockpiles were worryingly low. What is the situation now? Papperger: I think that is still the case. You simply cannot produce missiles that quickly, and that is why we at Rheinmetall are launching a major investment programme, and not just us but many manufacturers. And there are severe bottlenecks in rocket motors, but also in warheads, and we have to become dramatically faster here in order to get Germany, but also Europe and NATO, back up to target levels that are sufficient if we are threatened. Euronews: Where do we stand on the Skyranger? The systems have been ordered, but will they arrive in time? How fast is this moving now? Papperger: Yes, with the Skyranger – and this really is a narrative that keeps coming up. Under the contract, we have to start series deliveries of the Skyranger in 2027. That will happen, and at the moment we are only facing minimal delays. There are a number of technologies we need to update: the chassis, the radar technology and the missiles that have to be integrated. But I am firmly convinced that together with BAAINBw (the Federal Office of Bundeswehr Equipment, Information Technology and In-Service Support), and with the ministry, we will find a good solution in this area. Our people are working on it day and night, and as you know, capacity in the Skyranger segment is being ramped up massively. From the end of next year we will build, or be able to build, up to 400 a year. So I really do not see any cause for concern. Euronews: There is a joint venture for deep strike capabilities. Where do we stand on that? Papperger: The joint venture that we have on the one hand with Destinus, and on the other with Lockheed Martin: with Lockheed Martin we cover the artillery rockets, and we are working on cruise missiles with Destinus. These two joint ventures are in the absolute final stage before signature, and we expect to receive the first order for cruise missiles at the end of this year or the beginning of next year. Euronews: Shouldn't we be building simpler systems, but more of them? Isn't that what Ukraine shows? Papperger: We are doing that as well, but in some areas it does not help. If you look at the performance of the Skyranger today, it can shoot down a missile travelling at Mach 3. You cannot do that with an interceptor system, and you cannot do it with a simple device. And if you talk to the Inspector of the German Army today, he will tell you: "In two years the threat will look completely different." The Skyranger really is a system that offers multi-capabilities. We cannot achieve that with our interceptor solution or with our simpler solutions. We also have '.50 guns', which can shoot down light drones, category 1 drones. That becomes extremely difficult once you are dealing with, for example, jet-powered drones – they are barely manageable. That is why we believe that a sustainable, long-term solution is the better option. Euronews: How big a driver of employment is the defence industry, and Rheinmetall in particular? Papperger: I believe we are a strong engine of job creation. At the moment, excluding the civil sector, around 34,000 people work at Rheinmetall. We are growing by about 10,000 net per year, and our goal is to reach 70,000 by 2030, supported by a supply chain employing 210,000 people. So if you add that together, that is almost 300,000 people. That is a real engine for jobs. Euronews: How quickly can arms and ammunition production – companies like Rheinmetall – be ramped up? Papperger: We are doing it. We have already shown it with ammunition, for example. In medium calibre we have increased output from under one million to four million rounds. In artillery we have gone from 70,000 to 1.5 million rounds. For tank ammunition, we are now at 240,000 rounds, up from 40,000, 50,000, 60,000 depending on the year. So we are doing it. And what we are doing now is doubling our trucks. The logistic and tactical vehicles are now being more than doubled. So we are doing that. The problem at the moment is that we do not have the orders to do even more. Rheinmetall has an investment programme worth 30 billion euros over six years, and it is extraordinary what we are investing right now. That is why it is so important that the signal we have sent today – the minister being here, and taking care to ensure that we not only build up capacity but that it is used sustainably and people have jobs – really comes across. For me, this has been a very strong, very positive signal, and it reassures me somewhat that the federal government is truly shouldering its responsibility here. Euronews: What comes next? Drones have been a major topic recently. What will be the next focus – space, which arguably already is, or combat robots, humanoid robots? Papperger: Robots will come, that is absolutely clear. We have a research centre in Bremen for humanoid robots and we are working on them. We do not yet have any serial products, which is why we have not gone to the media with it. But we are investing a lot of money there. Space is another area where we are investing heavily, in satellite construction on the one hand, and in communications processing on the other. That means all the information we receive from satellites should be properly processed. And drones will remain, and so will everything else, because they are needed. For combined-arms warfare you need artillery, armoured weapons, conventional ammunition, drones and missiles. The only question now is how much you need of each. It has to be a mix. And that will change: the quantities in the individual areas will change. In our own coverage: also watch the latest Euronews exclusive report on the German tank brigade in Lithuania: