How “Toxically Optimistic” Zainab Johnson Found a Fan (and Hype Woman) in Michelle Obama

“Washington, DC, make some noise for Zainab Johnson.” The intro itself isn’t an original way to start Johnson’s latest special, Netflix’s Toxically Optimistic, but the individual speaking as she takes the Howard Theatre stage marks a comedy first. That’s Michelle Obama riling up the audience. Johnson, the actress and stand-up who saw her comedy profile surge with 2023’s Hijabs Off, didn’t just get the former former First Lady to introduce her special. The Obamas’ Higher Ground produced the hour, out Oct. 27, a first for their ever-expanding company. So how did Johnson get into business with the Mrs. Obama? By accidentally kind of snubbing her a few years back. Johnson was in Detroit for a show in late 2024, not far from where Kamala Harris was stumping for her presidential run. Obama was set to attend the rally, so when her team engaged Johnson about meeting her there, Johnson jumped in a car and headed that way. “But I didn’t know how political rallies work,” says Johnson. “I thought you just pull up, park and walk in. No, they shuttle you from a mall that’s ten miles away. I get there and realize I only have enough time to turn around if I’m going to make it to my show. I tell her people that I’m so sorry. And they’re like, ‘Are you sure? Because Michelle is really looking forward to meeting you.’ I know this sounds crazy, but I gotta go be a professional comedian.” Fortunately for Johnson, she’d get another chance a few weeks later —an encounter that’s since proven quite fruitful. Speaking during a recent episode of The Hollywood Reporter podcast I’m Having an Episode (listen to the complete interview on episode on Spotify, Amazon Music, Apple), Johnson talked about finding a champion in Mrs. Obama, confusing U.K. audiences with a bit about her decision to buy a gun and the billboard she recently spotted that told her all she needed to know about TV’s backslide into defaulting to white actors. So how did you meet Mrs. Obama after this near-miss? In 2024, when Kamala Harris was campaigning, I was in Atlanta when Michelle was there for this bipartisan “Get out the vote” thing. A lot of powerful women in Hollywood were in this room — Kerry Washington, Shonda Rhimes — and I had just had this encounter with these celebrity girls. I was like, “Hey y’all, I’m a fan!” They looked at me like I was dirt. I will not say their names because I’m a huge fan of theirs. I don’t want the world to turn on them. So, I sat down, like, “I don’t know how I got in this room, but let me sit my ass down.” As soon as Michelle walks in the room, everybody flocks to her. She turns, sees me and she says, “Zainab Johnson!” She pulls me up to hug her. She turns me around to Shonda Rhimes, like, “Did you see this girl’s special? It’s fantastic!” She just starts raving about me. In my mind, I’m like, “My God, this is crazy.” Please tell me the women who blew you off were watching as all of this happened. Yes, they saw it. Right after they see Ms. Michelle fawning over me, they come back and apologize. It’s like a high school movie. Like a Mean Girls short starring Zainab Johnson, Michelle Obama and three beautiful, famous girls that will remain nameless. This is the first comedy special produced by the Obamas. I picture you walking into a general meeting, someone handing you a bottled water and Michelle and Barack just hanging out in a conference room. But I’m guessing that’s not how it happened. It’s so far off, not that I haven’t been to Higher Ground for some meetings been offered a wonderful bottle of water. So let’s fast forward to the top of 2026. My team and I decide I’m doing this special. I don’t care if I’m producing it or funding it myself. I’m not gonna wait on anybody to give me permission to put this out. But I had this idea as I was watching Sheng Wang’s special. I’ve always liked how Ali Wong sets the table for him. I thought, “Dang, if somebody were to introduce me, who would I want it to be? What if I got Michelle Obama to do it?” So I called my managers and said, “I’m gonna ask Michelle Obama to introduce my special.” Just voice of God. That’s all I need. I don’t need her to show her face. I don’t need her to produce it. I’m gonna do this thing all by myself.Which is not what happened. Maybe like a week or so later, I’m out to dinner with my friend, and, Michelle’s team, I get a text from them. “Hey, she’s recording the intro right now.” Simultaneously, I get a phone call from my managers. “Yes, she’s recording it. They want to produce the special. How do you feel about that?” I’m having all of the emotions. So they’re like, “Hello?” My friend who’s at dinner with me is asking what’s happening because she can see my face is stunned. And I’m like, “I would absolutely love that.” So then managers start screaming. And when I tell my friend, she says something so interesting to me. She asked how did this happen? “I just asked her to intro me.” She said, “You know what? That’s God, the universe, whatever you want to call it, telling you you can ask for more.” Something I learned about you in this special is that you bought a gun, at your friend’s suggestion, when you moved into a new house. How did the experience of buying a gun compare to how you thought it would be?When they were like, “Get a gun,” I’m thinking we gonna go get a gun with no serial number. I’m thinking we’re getting a back alley gun, right? No. When you go the legal route in California, you have to take classes, you have to get certified, then you have to go to the gun range with a with a certified person. I had to take a test. This used to be in my set, because this this set has come a long way. But I used to talk about how in California, you take a 20-question multiple choice test. I got two of the questions wrong, and they still gave me the gun. That you can get up to five questions wrong and they still give you a gun. That margin of error is crazy to me. And that bar is significantly lower in many other states. When I was touring this through the South, they were like, “Girl, just go to a Walmart! A gas station! Just make sure you have your driver’s license.” Then it was “Girl, you don’t even need that! Just make sure you got the money.” So this went through several incarnations, but you performed an early version at Edinburgh Fringe. This made me wonder how the U.K. audience responds to gun material versus a U.S. audience? The headline of one British paper’s review was “U.S. comic targets gun culture.” It was a bit different in Edinburgh, but I would not have described that show as “she takes on guns.” What’s interesting is that I didn’t just tour it in the U.K., I toured it in Paris. I brought it to Australia, a lot of places where civilians are unfamiliar with day-to-day gun ownership. I remember I would cold open the show with, “I got a gun.” A lot foreign audiences, they would feel confirmed about America with Donald Trump, like, “Yup! We knew it.” Slowly, they’d see some of the material that’s in the special now and they’d be like, “Well, if everybody who has a gun is like you, I guess it’s OK?” With a lot of people, I’m able to get them to see how I’m seeing things. The Edinburgh audience is an older audience. So when I would be like, “I got a gun,” they would be like “ha ha ha” and literally reach for their partner. Then I’d say, “I mean, I don’t have it on me. I don’t think they would have let me through customs.” Then they would understand, OK, this is gonna be a fun time. During a recent interview, you said that the only person that relates to Black women are other Black women. Knowing that, but also knowing that your audience is much broader, I’m curious how some material played. There’s one bit, during which you recount the potential outcomes of a scary encounter walking down a sidewalk. Predicting your possible death, you say, “I’m a Black woman in America. I’ve got to solve my own murder.” It’s a horrifying statement, because it’s very honest, but you play it for laughs. How did that one land on the road? Yeah, I gotta solve my own murder before I go. That’s painfully true, but that’s comedy, right? You bring levity. I’ve toured this hour in different places and when I drop that line, sometimes I would get a standing ovation. Sometimes I would liberate people in the room. Not just Black women. People who have that awareness and understand that truth. And sometimes, I would bring a really laughing crowd down to a sobering reality. It’d be like, “Wait, my God, that’s terrible.” I’m proud that I was able to convey that. It’s such a powerful thing, to convey that in between the absurdity. I’m happy that it landed and I’m happy that it made the final cut. You’re also an actress, and we’ve been talking a lot at work about how TV opportunities have been cratering for people of color. It’s like Hollywood has completely abandoned this push that, for a little while, actually seemed like it was gaining traction. So as you navigate that part of your career, what are the conversations you’re having about opportunities? What does your team say? The talks have been the same, which is, “There’s so little work.” I’m getting the same amount of enthusiasm and willingness to meet with me and pitch an idea. But that last part? The willingness to spend money, to invest, that’s the part. But entertainment is whatever the world is exhibiting at the moment. This might sound crazy, but I haven’t seen this in a very long time. I was driving up La Brea and I saw a billboard for a procedural show. All five of the cast were just cis white people. I I haven’t seen that in years.It’s very back. And I think I know the show you’re referring to. I couldn’t believe it. I almost had to avoid a traffic accident. Am I seeing what I think that I’m seeing? We’re back in the nineties with Friends. We’re back in those conversations. I think we’re in a time that we can call a regression. We are regressing. It’s scary and it’s sad. This is not specific to the show we’re talking that we will not name. But I think it’s all gonna prove to be very boring.